Recently I shared how, despite our aversion to employment, our net worth has continued to grow by leaps and bounds .
You may (rightfully) think this would be a cause for celebration, but writing about it surfaced a lot of old memories from a childhood of scarcity.
They say childhood poverty has profound and lasting implications. It impacts health, brain development, education, and ultimately earning potential.
I know this to be true, because it is only in the last year or two (now in my 40s) that I’ve finally (maybe?) come to peace with those implications myself.
Scarcity
I have a lot of positive childhood memories: Christmas morning at my grandparents’ home, riding my bike around the neighborhood, swimming throughout the summer…
I also have a few…. what should we call them? Issues, maybe.
I borrowed this graphic from an excellent assessment of the impact of poverty by the Chid Poverty Action Group in the UK (pre-Brexit, obviously.) I can relate to pretty much everything on this chart.
Poverty damages. It damages childhoods; it damages life chances; and it damages us all in society.
I remember in 3rd grade being embarrassed to tell my teacher that my step-dad was unemployed.
I remember quitting sports and cub scouts, in part due to worry about parental finances. They wanted to provide opportunities, but I felt bad for accepting it.
I remember feeling unlikeable because I was poor and lived in a trailer park. I remember being bullied because of it.
Home sweet home
I remember feeling that I had to hide the fact that I got free school lunches.
I remember feeling judged (and shame) when helping Mom with the grocery shopping and paying with food stamps.
I remember being sick often (tonsillitis & bronchitis), but going to school anyway because my parents couldn’t afford time off work.
I remember feeling angry, often… apparently the kissing cousin of shame and fear.
I remember hearing, “We can’t afford that” over and over and over again.
Photo and newspaper clipping courtesy of Grandma
School was not my favorite place, but I tested well. I was pushed into Advanced Placement English and Math classes. My Senior year I won the school Math Award. I was Academic All-State in Football (the key word being academic.) The school guidance counselor encouraged me to study engineering… and when I started college I tested out of 3 semesters of calculus.
This should all have been an honor and a reason to be proud, but instead I felt guilty and a total fraud. I didn’t work at any of this; I didn’t earn it.
I almost didn’t apply to college, because college applications had fees. $25, $50, $100… I didn’t have that kind of money. So I just applied to a couple nearby schools… I couldn’t afford MIT or Stanford anyway, so why bother?
My youngest brother was 5 years old when I left for college. We were really close, and I felt guilty for leaving (and still do, really.) Family or future? A distance of more than miles grew between us… alas, the alternative was taking a manual labor job at the local meat packing plant, which today pays $12/hour… same as it did 20 years ago
College was good to me… I enjoyed learning for the first time. But I was scared… scared to be away from home, scared that I wasn’t smart enough for college, scared that this was all being funded with debt and I would end up bankrupt and destitute.
I felt like I was finally getting somewhere when I landed a well paying summer internship. 3 weeks later when the company reported poor earnings, I was let go. For a time I lived partly off Saltine crackers and ketchup from the condiment station in the school cafeteria. Friends went on spring break to Florida and the Caribbean… I worked overtime in the sump pump factory.
I almost died the week of graduation, moved myself over the weekend, and then started my first job on Monday. I used a credit card advance check to pay the deposit on my new apartment.
I was now $40,000 in debt (top 5% of debt load for graduates in today’s dollars.) No rest for the wicked.
Abundance
Scarcity and fear propelled me. I had a job, but knew I could lose it at any moment. My Dad was laid off when I was a kid. I lost my summer internship due to staff cuts. I was expendable…
So I scrimped and saved and paid down my student loans. I worked over time, cashed out my vacation hours, and did anything and everything that was asked of me. I was making progress.
I got a new job with a sign-on bonus, a moving package, and a payback clause if I left for any reason in the first year… I felt all of my new coworkers were smarter than me, and spent that whole year in shock and awe.
But… fake it ’til you make it. When you were successful, you were supposed to have cars, a house, and fly to exotic places for vacation. I have those things… Am I successful now?
As a kid, Mom would read to us every night and take us to the library often. I think she knew that she couldn’t give us much, but she could give us some of that there fancy book lernin’. Now in my 20s, one day a package arrived with a book from Mom: Robert Kiyosaki’s Retire Young, Retire Rich.
“This is bullshit!” I said, and threw the book across the room. I guess I was still angry :)
(To be fair, my opinion on that book is still the same.)
Around this time I finally paid off the student loans. A few months later I would take a vacation and decide I liked it a whole lot more than working. A year later I would meet my future wife. And 9 years after that I would submit my resignation. We were now truly experiencing a life of abundance.
But you’ve heard all of that before…
Internal Abundance
We have now been early retired for about 6 years, living our dream.
Despite understanding that we had “enough”, money was still a driving factor in many of our decisions. For example, we might briefly consider a flight with a connection because it cost $20 less (penny wise, pound foolish.)
But… It was only 4 years ago that we felt secure enough to have a child of our own.
Shrek Jr
It is only in the last 2 or 3 years where I actually felt charitable, something I wanted to do instead of something I was supposed to do.
It is only in the last year or two that I’ve completely internalized this abundance. The fear is gone. The anger is gone. The sense that I hadn’t earned it, the feeling that one error or mistake could upend it all… it is all gone. Instead, there is a quiet sense of appreciation. I’ve now, finally, become accustomed to wealth.
They say childhood poverty has profound and lasting implications…
Gratitude
What a long strange trip it’s been…. in the spirit of last night’s 2018 Academy Awards, I would like to thank my Mom for the books, the sacrifices, and the encouragement to pursue a better life. Also, thank you to my Grandma for always making it clear that I was welcome whenever I needed it.
I’d also like to thank my childhood friend, Jason, who I met in 5th grade. He was self-assured, out-going, and a terrific athlete, basically everything I was not. His befriending me and encouragement to join sports was a turning point in life. Which is why just before he passed away last year, we adjusted our travels to bring me to my home town so we could visit one last time.
I also give thanks to my sister and brothers, for understanding why I left. I’m proud of all of you, for the lives and families you’ve built. It is a real joy to see our children playing together.
Most importantly, thank you Winnie for being so full of love and positivity. You are amazing. Thank you for making me a better person.
And thanks to you, for reading and for your support.
And thanks to the Academy. Even though I haven’t won an Award, I feel as though I’ve won at life.
Thanks for sharing this. I can relate to much of it. Grew up blue collar, child of divorce. Almost ended up in a trailer park after said divorce, but my grandparents swooped in to keep Mom afloat. No luxury vacations and often skipped lunch. I worked one summer at the pickle factory, third shift during college. I guess in the end, having *some* struggle early in life helps motivate, but I’d agree with the findings that for most, the damage from real poverty is too high a cost.
Hi Cubert,
Congrats on your success.
I think you are right, some hurdles to overcome can help. It is important to feel that you earned something, and to learn from mistakes and failure. If the hurdles are too high though…. a lot of people never make it out.
How do you feel about pickles these days?
We just bought a jar of Famous Dave’s sweet and spicy chips at Costco. I cannot quit them it seems.
Hi, great article. Learning from our experiences lift the burden instead of being consumed by it. By the way, for some reason I’m receiving your blog post twice. Regards.
I got it. I’m subscribe to your mail list and follow your blog-Wordpress. :)
Wow. This is such a great post. Mr. ThreeYear grew up really poor, too, and there is so much in this post that I read and nodded, thinking, “I know he felt/feels this way, too.” The insecurity that a childhood of poverty brings, the anxiety, that part I would take away. But the work ethic, his drive, his ability to hyper-focus when the going gets tough–I feel like those are things he gained from being poor that make him a better person. I don’t know if he would agree. :) I’m so glad to hear that you’re at a place now where you feel secure and deserving of what you have. I would say you’ve definitely won at life.
Thanks Laurie. It would be interesting to hear if Mr 3Year agrees with you :)
Since I had the good fortune to live and work amongst highly educated and successful people, I know that work ethic, drive, and focus can be learned from things other than poverty. Now, how to instill those skills and values in the next generation…
We were definitely lower middle class. I spent several years living in a trailer park. While my memories of my childhood are fond ones, it has driven my financial choices. How could it be otherwise, really? It will be interesting to see what my daughter, who has grown up in relative abundance, derives from her childhood experience. I wonder if frugality is inheritable? Let’s hope so.
I don’t think it’s inheritable. My kids are less appreciative of what they have because they think abundance is normal. I Flew on an airplane for the first time when I was working in a professional job after college.
On the weekend we took kids out for an expensive brunch and they just think it’s normal and complain if something isn’t just how they like it. As a kid a breakfast out was a rare treat and we knew it was special.
The kids’ peers are even more spoiled so they are always comparing how they have better video games and trips to Hawaii etc.
I have wealth because I worked hard for it and still buy used cars (exotic ones now but still good deals).
I don’t know how to help the kids on this topic
My son grew up poor. When I was able to make his life better, there did seem to be a lack of gratefulness. So I took him down to TJ, a border city in Mexico. We were crossing the bridge, and he saw all the kids begging for money in ratty clothes. We also saw a boy leading his blind parents by rope to the bridge to beg.
He was 10 years old. Coming back over the bridge he had me cash a $10 bill to dimes, and he proceeded to give these to the children. It blew me away. I never said nothing to him about it, but instinctively he wanted to help.
This is beautiful, Mike.
Perceived wealth is completely subjective (we just compare ourselves to those around us) so we can add a little gratitude by changing the people we compare to.
Humbling post, most people who were not born into wealth and yet created their own, can probably relate to some aspect of this. I’ve been reading a book about Stoicism that reminds me to think about gratitude, mindfulness, and that material possessions will not make you happy. Mostly if you feel out of place, you must be doing something right! Keep writing, I’ve got 6 more years to work and need your motivation and wisdom! :-)
Practicing stoicism is a huge help! The compiled works of Marcus Aurelius is something I still try to read every year.
6 years goes by fast, enjoy it!
Thank you for this post! As a child we (my family) were financially insecure and it has affected me in so many ways. It took me until my middle years to believe that I could have a seat at the table… And I am sorry about the loss of your friend, Jason.
Thank you Cara :(
The table is so big, I’m happy you found a seat.
Thanks for writing this. I have had to come to terms with issues due to growing up in scarcity. It really does have a profound impact on development. Now, I can afford all the things my child needs to grow (healthy food, nice home, clean and good quality clothing) and participate in her school life (dancing and academia – tutors, private lessons, etc.). On the flip side, I think it’s important for those who grow up in abundance (like my daughter) learn about scarcity and compassion. As a single child that has never come from a place of scarcity I try to teach her about her good fortune and to practice gratitude and compassion for others. We volunteer together, and most recently, took her to India to experience all the beautiful and not so beautiful parts of another country and poverty with a less robust welfare system. It was one of the most awesome and humbling trips we’ve ever taken. We all returned more grateful. Her most recent goal is to join the Peace Corps after college.
“I try to teach her about her good fortune and to practice gratitude and compassion for others. ”
Imagine the world if all families taught (and actually practiced) this. Thank you
We aspire to do the same.
ah but I wanna see your life of abundance going to hell when the market crashes 90% and you’re 90% allocated on stocks!
Always up for a coffee, stop on by
LOL. A hater who names themselves “Hater”. How original.
Normally I just delete / not approve these comments and then go do fun things with positive people, but I chose to let this one through and I see it has generated a lot of comments.
Hater, if you ever feel like trying to make a better life and be a positive member of the Go Curry Cracker Community, you are more than welcome. If attacking me helps you bridge that gap, I’m here for you.
For everyone else – sometimes people end up in a bad place and anger defines them. Lashing out may be the only joy they experience. See any Breitbart reader as an example.
Darkness cannot drive out darkness, only light can do that.
Hate cannot drive out hate, only love can do that.
– MLK
sounds like sour grapes!
Stop Loss Order – Stop Loss Order :-) Mr./Miss Hater !!! Look it up and Learn Well !!!
Can you please stop by my blog? A sure sign of good traffic is getting knucklehead commenters to leave their droppings. Thanks!
Hater, what are you invested in that’ll protect ya from the 90% fall while providing for a decent return in the majority of years?
Being the oldest boy of 4, I remember taking responsibility for telling my siblings we can’t afford things. We didn’t have it too bad. There was always food on the table, and my grandfather passed away before my dad lost his job, leaving us a paid off home to live in. My parents were terrible with money, but at least my mom was smart enough not to mortgage the house. We had more than just financial issues and I almost didn’t go to college. I was lucky to find a job that paid enough for me to work my way through school while mediating a divorce. Saving for FI was definitely driven by a desire for security.
I wouldn’t want to revisit my childhood, but it’s something I’m happy to have gone through. It got me to where I am today. I still find myself worrying about money even after reaching financially independence, but I’m starting to get used to it :)
Thanks for sharing your story. I’d have to agree, I think you’re winning this game of life :)
Lots in common, you and I.
I was also the oldest of 4 and did a lot of “parenting.” I was usually the one getting the kids ready for school in the morning, etc… I didn’t often like to think about childhood stuff, and I basically avoided even visiting my home town for many years… yeah, more issues than just money. It’s good to be on the other side though.
Now with your travel and surf schedule, I imagine it is hard to find the time to worry about money though, right? ;)
Nice one.
My childhood was traumatic too, but in different ways. My dad was mostly employed, but had no idea what to do with money: “Hey kids, we bought a timeshare!” When construction hit the skids in the winter, he’d get laid off and it would get a little tough. The drinking was the tough part.
I too have come to peace with money too and it’s been recent (no more nightmares!). I haven’t made peace with the alcoholism though. No physical abuse, but still rough memories. Dad sometimes drunk so much that he couldn’t find the bathroom. “Daddy, what are you doing in my closet?”
Sorry. This is therapeutic.
The good thing is all of this made me stronger. I’ll never be an alcoholic or struggle with money.
Carl my man, no need to apologize ever. Happy to chat about this stuff anytime you want, and you are welcome in Asia anytime.
It is really good to hear the nightmares are gone (I’m happy to say I no longer wake up in a cold sweat because I was dreaming about being evicted or laid off… ) Healing is a long process.
“I’m happy to say I no longer wake up in a cold sweat because I was dreaming about being evicted or laid off…”
I used to have the same types of nightmares! Like I mentioned, we were a lot better off money-wise than you, but it still put a terror in me.
Looking back, how silly it was for us to worry! We both developed software, so it wouldn’t have been difficult to get jobs. I was never laid off or fired either.
I’ll make it out to your neck of the woods someday. Not in 2018, but before the decade is up…
It’s amazing how much our financial decisions are impacted by our past. I’m sorry you did not grow up financially secure. I’m also so happy for you that you were able to use that stress to achieve a level of wealth most can only dream of.
I found this post incredibly motivating. Thanks for sharing!
Thank you for the vulnerability, it’s a powerful post. I’m curious how you would encourage those of us with children actively (but slowly) seeking FIRE to balance the need for significant frugality with the need to provide opportunities and “amenities” that help them assimilate socially. My child is still quite young (4) and I’ve definitely veered towards spending a fair bit on zoo/ children’s museum memberships, the best daycare I can find even if it costs a little more and misc. classes (Chinese language to keep him in touch with his country of origin, soccer etc.). It’s hard to know what’s going to matter long term to him vs. what won’t. Thoughts? Questions to ask self? I definitely don’t want him to grow up feeling less than or have the fall-out you experienced because I opted for high-savings instead…
Hi Darcy
There is a substantial difference between choosing not to spend money and not having money to spend. One is a lifestyle, the other is a struggle for life. One is moderation, the other is deprivation.
When there is a roof over the head (and no worries about being evicted), there is food on the table (and everyone knows there will be more tomorrow), warm clothes to wear (clean and stylish), and loving parents who ask questions like how do I balance FIRE and opportunities for Jr, that is all a child really needs. The rest is window dressing.
Sounds to me like you have it figured out pretty well.
I’m circling back through older posts and stumbled across this comment, in response to my own inquiry about balancing frugality with a child’s needs. I am stunned that I wrote it 6 years ago, it feels like 1 or 2. Which is both a reminder 1. That the time does go by *so* quickly and to avoid “another year” syndrome (I am cautiously hopeful I may be at FIRE, in number crunching confirmation mode)
2. How much I appreciate that I’ve been benefitting from your insight for over 10 years now. What a gift. I am grateful.
(Currently specifically grateful for your pay no taxes posts. I’m deep-diving into the tax strategies bc it seems like I may be nearing the point of utilizing them!)
Wow, thank you. Truly. And congratulations on all you have accomplished over these few years.
This post is probably my all-time favorite of things I have written… I mention my little brother and my grandma in this post, both have died this year and that has me feeling all kinds of things.
Did you find the balance you were looking for? Any tips to share? Anything left to figure out?
Great story! Dave Ramsey would love it.
Curious why you don’t like Rich Dad? He’s about creating wealth and independence, although differently than your route.
I don’t agree with 100% of his ideas nor do I believe in 100% of Dave Ramsey’s ideas, nonetheless, I’m on FIRE, glad and grateful to be here.
Mostly because it’s just the same 2 paragraphs written over and over again, with a bunch of untruths and factually inaccurate stuff mixed in. He’s basically a con man.
Fascinating post. Given the high confidence required to take the early retirement path, I’m now very confused. What gave you the courage to aspire to that end goal? And when you reached the point of exit from work life, what gave you the confidence to do it?
My father had a Depression Era mindset that stayed with him throughout his live. Pinching pennies was integral to our life. He retired at 73, not because he needed to work that long, but because he felt he needed to do so, to have enough money to retire. Yet, despite this, Dad took us on trips every year. We went to Europe 3 times while I was growing up. Although we were a middle class family by the standards of the day, our family travels made me feel privileged and gave me the travel bug.
But there must have been some major catalysts for you to develop and maintain such ambition despite having grown up in poverty. I would love to know what these were.
Hi Paul
Just thinking about my own experience, there is zero courage required to get started. Living well beneath your means to pay off student loans / debt requires making good choices about housing / transportation / food expenses, which then translates to healthy savings rates when the debt is gone. We just continued on that path, banking increases in income instead of succumbing to lifestyle inflation.
Courage didn’t really come into play until several years after we were FI. Our target was a portfolio that would support our desired cost of living, which was significantly higher than what we were spending… and I continued working 3 years after that.
People in the biz call that “One More Year Syndrome.” Some people work one more year for decades…
I think a few things made it possible to finally pull the trigger:
– in 2008 we lost about $400k – that was a big number, but we noticed that it had no impact on our day to day lives
– our dividend income was enough to cover our current cost of living – I was banking my whole paycheck
– we knew dividend income could cover 100% of our expenses if we started in low cost of living countries (e.g. Mexico, Guatemala)
– I had researched the hell out of portfolio longevity studies and felt comfortable with the statistics
Wow, thank you for this. “Internalize the abundance”–I wrote that down, that’s exactly what I have to do in this next stage of my life. Grew up with little, moved eight times in first ten years of life, never asked for anything from my single mom–new clothes, cool toys, etc. Vacations were car camping, not Florida like my classmates. I remember coveting a box of those fat Crayola markers that all my friends had and never asking for them because I knew it was “frivolous.” Luckily, I had smarts and great teachers who encouraged me. Worked throughout college (and two jobs in the summertime), achieved my dream of getting into medical school. Now I make 193K a year as a family doc and still can’t shake that “poor” feeling. I jokingly call myself “the queen of self-deprivation,” I wear the same one pair of shoes to work for years until the soles are bare, buy one or two new items of clothing a year (always work clothes), always make excuses for why I can’t or should not afford something. My husband is always begging me to “buy something nice for yourself” but it is a hard lesson to learn when the early lessons screamed the opposite. It is amazing how often that little inner voice of doubt and fear speaks to me. I have no problem spending money on my kids or my family, but when it comes to myself, I have this really weird guilt/shame thing that I need to get over. Thank you, GCC, for your candor and sensitivity about the challenging psychological metamorphosis that those of us who go from poor to rich must undergo.
Winnie and I were reading your comment together, and she said, “Her husband hit the jackpot!” Considering that one of the most FAQs I get is how do I get my wife to stop spending so much money, that is definitely true. Be sure to tell him ;)
All jokes aside, we both can definitely relate to this. One of Winnie’s first viral posts included a picture of my jeans with giant holes in them. They were long past garbage bin worthy, but I still didn’t want to let go. Although less often, Winnie still will hesitate to buy stuff for herself because she feels guilty for doing so.
2 strategies I’ve read about:
– give yourself a must-spend allowance every month – $10, $100, whatever. The only rules are you must spend it and you must spend it on something that you don’t need.
– invest savings in something that pays interest, and then spend the interest on anything you want / need. It’s “free” money (some people say) so it makes it easier to spend
Through repetition, it gets easier to spend “frivalously” and the guilt response is reduced. The feeling of guilt/shame is often derived from the (irrational) sense of being unworthy, so combining these strategies with an affirmation that you are indeed worthy (look at all you’ve accomplished!) can be powerful.
Now I’m just an amateur psychologist over here, but when you husband says you should buy something for yourself, I think what he is really saying is love yourself. So sounds like you hit the jackpot too.
Thanks, Jeremy and Winnie. I think I’ll start with a box of those fat Crayola markers! Seriously though, this is a really good idea, turn it into forced spending, make a rule that I have to spend x amount on myself and just deal with it. I always find a reason why I shouldn’t go get a massage or buy a new bathing suit (wearing the one I own until the elastic is shot). Kind of like the Depression mentality my four grandparents grew up with. I have read that fear of embracing abundance means that you don’t trust the universe (or yourself) to continue to provide for your needs so you either hoard (which I do not do) or fear spending (which is me). And yes, we both hit the jackpot, as did you guys! Thank you for this blog!
I really like this idea! Make it fun and hang your first drawing on the fridge.
Sometimes people go with the “rip off the band-aid” approach, which is maybe buying some colored pencils at the art store next to the spa in Florence, Italy, where you’ve just had a nice massage to recover from the business class flight :)
Thank you for sharing. A courageous and well written post. I easily subscribed to your blog because it has been super useful and interesting. You show how it is possible to craft a life of your dreams. I hope you and your family continue to live a life of abundance!
Great story. I grew up in a remote village in China. My family was very poor, but not the poorest. Had a place to live. Some food was there, but not enough. Not much nutrition. No money for sure. Some of my childhood memories were related to the emotions caused by lack of food, and money. On the other hand, I learnt to be fugal, and was content about a simple life.
Right after college, some of my friends came to America, as their families were well off financially. I dreamed a lot, too, but could not afford the TOEFL/GRE test fees, school application fees, and the travel and living cost here. After saving for years in China, I finally landed on this great country in mid 1990s. I’m glad I made it on my own.
Thanks a lot for sharing your story.
Congratulations on your success, Helen. I think we greater appreciate reaching our goals when we have struggled to achieve them. Applications fees can be a killer, I don’t know if it’s different these days (probably worse but hopefully they waive fees based on financial hardship) but college and med school application fees were a real stumbling block for me. I broke down sobbing in a bookstore once when I saw the MCAT study guide I wanted cost $50 that I did not have (of course I could not afford a real prep course so I had to do it on my own). I donate every year to my high school general scholarship fund specifically to help defer the cost of applying to college, no one should have to compromise on the goal of an education just because they can’t even afford to knock on the door.
JPMD,
Thanks for sharing your thought. I’m sure, the charity fund you donated to will help a lot of kids who are in financial need.
Thanks for sharing,this gave me teary eyes,can relate
God bless you and your family! I truly enjoyed reading this as I could relate on almost every level. I have learned so much from all of your posts. Onward!!
Thank you so much for sharing. I hope I can get where you are one day. I did not grow up poor – my insecurity started when my (seemingly) stable country fell apart in the 90s and I became a refugee/asylum seeker over night. I was lucky enough to move here in the 90s on the diversity visa (the one our current president loves to trash) and have made a really good life for myself – even decided to have kids, which I swore I never would. But still, there are days when nothing seems safe enough. It’s a constant struggle to remind myself that just because I had to flee once doesn’t mean I’ll ever have to flee again. My American-born husband can’t really relate (don’t blame him) and thinks I worry too much, but then – I never thought I’d ever become a refugee the first time around either. So yeah, well done on getting where you are, it’s a lot to overcome. This is my first comment – I love your blog.
Vanessa, keep the faith that all will be well. As a fellow immigrant, I know what you mean. We have been through tumultuous times once and there is always that ‘eye open’ that it could happen again. We are here in America. We are lucky. You have resources, I have resources. Keep building those resources as much as you are able. We will be fine. Peace!
Thanks, Sandy! You’re absolutely right – we are very lucky to be here. I remind myself every day of that. :)
Sounds like you had a rougher go at it as a kid than I did (though I’ve had plenty of gubmint cheese, subsidized housing, living in a trailer, out of work parents, etc just never remember a time when I was actually hungry or lacked for anything really).
It’s taken me a while to get into the whole “…and now I’m wealthy, holy shit!” mood. Partly by your example it’s sinking in :) No need to vacation solely in super cheap places or squeeze every penny. No need to underspend our potential when we know we could spend more!!
holy shit I’m wealthy would be a good name for a personal finance blog
Thanks for sharing. You had a rough go as a kid, but it tempered you. Everyone needs to go through a little hardship so they know what it’s all about. My family had a tough time for a few years when we first immigrated to the US. My parents worked minimum wage jobs and our finance was not stable at all.
Now, I have more money than my parents ever did and I still don’t feel wealthy. It’s hard to get rid of the scarcity mindset. I’d probably try to save $20 on travel if we don’t have a kid. Now, our goal is to minimize crazy time so I don’t mind paying extra for direct flight.
Tempered is a good word, thanks Joe.
I struggle with imposter syndrome quite a bit, and felt some of that coming through in your post, Jeremy. I appreciate your candor in writing this. I’m sure it isn’t always easy to share that much of yourself or your past, but I’m glad to hear you’re coming to terms with your new situation.
From where I sit, you have earned it.
Thank you sir, I very much appreciate it.
Ahh yes, imposter syndrome… that’s the phrase I was looking for.
Signs of imposter syndrome, from wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impostor_syndrome
– Perfectionism
– Overworking
– Undermining one’s own achievements
– Fear of failure
– Discounting praise
And “benefits” – Some scholars have argued that feelings of impostor experience are potentially healthy and beneficial for career trajectory.
Looks like I’m the poster child for imposter syndrome ;)
I think even 5-10 years ago I wouldn’t have been able to write about this, but I’m good with all of it now
I am so glad you found success!
I always wonder (and I wonder this looking at my family, too)…why do people have kids when they aren’t ready? Why? Why do people do this to their kids? And do my parents not feel any guilt for taking other people’s money, as opposed to earning their own? I work hard, I think ahead. They, frankly, did not. I pay a lot of taxes towards families like my own, and that seems unfair as I work so hard.
Poverty (in America) is largely a choice, and it doesn’t seem to involve much sacrifice, but it sure involves a lot of sacrifice on the part of people subsidizing the poor. The anger and shame we feel having grown up poor should be focused on our parents, not society. They put us in that situation.
I don’t see my parents as having sacrificed, but as takers. Does anyone else feel this way?
Of course in the ideal world every child would be a wanted and well cared for child. I felt anger toward my mother for years for getting pregnant with me at age 17, it drastically limited her own opportunities and forced me to be raised in a challenging situation. However, I was eventually able to forgive and understand her predicament and appreciate all that I was given (such as her devotion, intelligence, and perseverance). I now work with impoverished people and believe that some of them have too many kids and have them too young because it is all they will ever be able to do–they know they won’t be getting degrees, running businesses, etc, so the biological imperative to reproduce is all they have to be proud of…I have heard both women and men boast to me about the six, eight, ten kids they have as if that in itself is a major achievement, when they can’t even afford to have one!
Your comment is one of the most enlightening I have read in a LONG time. There is so much truth in what you have written here. I was an unplanned pregnancy and it plunged my parents, who barely knew each other really, into decades of poverty and family ostracization. Thankfully, they only had 2 kids.
Mini-rant coming:
I see ideas like this often – Poverty (in America) is largely a choice, and it doesn’t seem to involve much sacrifice, but it sure involves a lot of sacrifice on the part of people subsidizing the poor.
Another way to state this is:
If you are poor, it is your fault.
We can extend that kind of thinking to other things:
If you are overweight, it is your fault.
If you have health problems, it is your fault.
If you’ve been raped, it is your fault.
This is a very common (and divisive) tactic to blame the victim. If it is the victim’s fault, I can waive responsibility and just go on with my life. Those people are weak and inferior, and deserve nothing.
On a personal level, we’ve all made mistakes. Hopefully we’ve learned from them, and shared our experience to help others not repeat them.
So why did you make mistakes? Was it your fault? Are you guilty of something? Are you a bad person? Are you undeserving of help? Are you a burden because of it, to society or family?
Or did you just have incomplete information? Did you have an undeveloped skill? Did you have conflicting values or social pressure or no good options available to you?
I was born when my Mom was 16, and she had to drop out of high school
Imagine that’s you. Now imagine that you go to the people that are supposed to protect you (say, your parents) and they shame you as a slut and a whore. Tell you that you are going to destroy their reputation at their church, because that is what is really important. Make it clear that abortion is not an option. What do you do? Is there a “right” answer?
This is a common occurrence in America today. Abstinence only sex education makes it more common.
If from time and distance and different experiences we might make a different choice, does that make us a better person? A superior person?
So… some ideas:
– being poor is seldom a choice, and poor people are not to blame. Often, they need help and education and opportunities.
– “some sacrifice” to get out of poverty requires hope, and hope is often in low supply. Blaming and shaming reduces that supply even further.
– it is not a sacrifice to help the poor, and the costs are not high (Plus, I hear from television that the US is a Christian nation?)
— look at a chart of US tax distributions – we spend far more on making orphans (military) than helping them
– me as an example, I’ve paid to society far more than it cost to help me rise. We should do more of that.
– anger and shame are strong emotions, and it is important to acknowledge and feel them to the fullest. Then when ready, those emotions need to move to acceptance, peace, and worthiness. Parents make mistakes. I make mistakes. You make mistakes. Forgiveness goes a whole lot further than resentment.
Anyhoo, that’s just me. Others feel differently.
Interesting to hear your perspective.
I disagree, and I do not say that as someone who grew up in luxury. There are basic things available in America to avoid poverty (at least for white, native-born Americans), and as I stated previously, I base this on my family’s experience. We have abortion, we have birth control, we have adoption. We have the ability (for the most part, and not always) to attend school and to avoid child marriage. There’s a certain arrogance to letting society pay one’s way in the land of plenty. Yes, I get that everyone makes mistakes. But some people make mistakes over and over. And the immigrants I grew up with, who had far harder lives than my family, seemed much more intent on making better choices. They came to America to find opportunities with a lot less privilege than my or many American families. I think Americans tend to make mistakes because they know they live in a fairly forgiving society.
I think a lot of America (my family included) is really soft. That’s why people come here- so much opportunity. But Americans have had it so easy that they make mistakes over and over again. There’s not really a lot of incentive to not make mistakes. And the worst kind of mistake is one that hurts someone else, not oneself, or that requires help from other people.
People should try harder, I guess.
How would you change the system to result in your ideal level of non-softness?
This attitude towards the poor that it’s their own fault is one of the most heart breaking things about America to me. I’ve lived in a number of different countries and I’ve never seen this elsewhere. Your comparison between immigrants and poor Americans is a very unfair one. People often forget that becoming an immigrant takes a lot of grit and determination (if I do say so myself), so you’re talking about a group of people who, although they may be poor at first, have the necessary mind frame to make things work out by sheer will power. Additionally, many immigrants may be poor here (at first), but they did not necessarily grow up poor so they know what not being poor looks like. Comparing that with people growing up in generational poverty or in unstable homes is deeply unfair.
But even if you disregard that argument, is it really fair to punish the children born into poverty? Do they not deserve to be helped so they can make a better life for themselves?
I also disagree that poor Americans “have it easy” and repeat mistakes for that reason – they have it harder than the poor in most other developed countries (and to no small extent because of attitudes like yours). There is no healthcare provided with most low paying jobs; the minimum wage has not increased since who knows when in some states, poor neighborhoods have worse schools because funding is based on property taxes. It goes on and on.
Now – are there some people that are “gaming the system” – probably, But I firmly believe that most people do not and that helping poor children escape poverty wipes out any losses from potential abuse. And, yes, I’ve heard the stories about a friend of a friend of a friend who lives like a king off of welfare – not very likely in my opinion.
I say all this as an immigrant – and a very successful one at that. And yes, I came here with nothing. And I could say that my success is mine alone, but that’s not really true – I grew up in a loving family with wonderful parents and good standard of living, which is what gave me that perseverance and determination to push through when the hard times came.
I have to say, I don’t think any of us is wealthy! I grew up in an area with a huge income and wealth gap, and was exposed equally to generational wealth of the social register type and also poverty of immigrants (I never understood the poverty of native-born Americans as there always seemed to be so many jobs that paid OK), but my exposure to extreme wealth has definitely cramped FIRE for me- I know what real wealth is, and it’s hard to not want to attain that level of influence, power, and comfort.
I’ve had lunch with billionaires and have friends worth $150 million. I’m good with where we are.
In that case you have won, absolutely.
Oops, sorry, didn’t mean to imply that we were at that level.
Two of my good friends started a successful company and have done well for themselves. Through work I had lunch with some triple comma people in groups (Bill Gates, Steve Ballmer, Steven Sinofsky… no way they would actually remember me though.) Also CEOs of other various companies.
Lots of stress at that level, running billion dollar businesses. I’m not envious.
As one of your siblings, I want to say thank you for leading the way. You were definitely missed when you went to college and moved away. I think having you do so helped make it an easier decision for the rest of us to eventually do the same as well.
Same with the retiring early and living the lifestyle you do now. Sharing all your lifestyle; all the hard work and determination to get there has helped inspire us to think beyond the traditional idea of work/career/retirement. I very much appreciate having you as a big brother. Keep up the awesome and inspiring work!
Thank you. I love you.
Thanks. That was a courageous topic to blog about. Great reminder that your background affects your future but it doesn’t have to define it. You are ultimately the architect of your own life.
I Love You ~ ALWAYS ~ Mom
I love you too
Growing up poor is definitely not a fun experience (I know what you’re talking about with the bullying, not being able to go on field trips, being forced to go to school while sick–for me it was the mumps–because parents had to work, etc). Glad you rose above it and got to where you are today! Sometimes scarcity gives us perspective. I would’ve never gotten to where I am today if I didn’t have that experience.
We both definitely got some perspective. I think you more than me from hearing your story…
Lots of people become quite successful even without the trauma, so I’d like to think I could have gotten to where we are today without it, but who knows.
Great post. I’m a newer reader and didn’t know you and Winnie have been together for so long, so many stages together. Someone in my family grew up not having much and they definitely still have the poverty mindset even though they are financially comfortable. Frequent shopping for things that aren’t needed happens all the time, because now they have the money to do so. So once they had money, they swung the opposite way and are a bit excessive. The infographic is interesting, I have a couple of people I’d like to show it to (including that person in my family) to hear their thoughts on it.
Yeah we’ve known each other 15 years now, and 8 year anniversary is in July.
It’s pretty common for people to become big spenders once they’ve “made it big” – see every lottery winner ever
Drops mic… wow, than you for sharing this heartfelt post. You also seem to have clarity over your emotions and situation that few people do. Some things just stick out in your story of life and become part of your narrative as to why you move forward.
When I was a kid, my mom said I should marry a doctor one day so I could be rich. At the time I said, if I want to be rich, I’ll become a doctor myself. That didn’t happen. So now I’m working to become FI!
A friend of mine said her parents told her, “You can fall in love with anyone, so make sure it is a rich guy.”
Thank you
This was fantastic. Thanks for sharing.
Thank you Brian
Being able to comfortably live a long way beneath one’s means makes ‘internalising abundance’ and ‘acclimatisation to wealth’ readily possible. The sun is shining in USA at the moment – oil self sufficiency – no war waste – no credit crunch – no inflation.
A rising tide lifts all boats
You have been very lucky and I commend you on your survivorship. As a female growing up in poverty in the UK in the 1970s, I can tell you that my opportunities were far more limited than yours. I remember no heating, no hot water, thrift clothing, no money, abusive father, depressed mother, judgmental teachers and peers, the very fact that I was a woman….. but I had a real talent for writing. That talent should’ve propelled me to university but, despite my teachers telling my parents that that was where I needed to go, I remember my mother telling me to take secretarial courses so that I could get out on my own and my father telling me that college ‘wasn’t for the likes of us’. I can’t describe how those directives altered the entire course of my life. Of course now, I realize that my father was jealous that I might actually make it out from under the limitations of poverty and …. university never happened for me. Instead I took those secretarial courses and went to work for different corporations at dead end jobs for a couple of years. Luckily, I met an American man, a mechanical engineer, who married me and brought me to California. Here in America, I grabbed the opportunity as an immigrant with BOTH HANDS, went to community college and ultimately ended up making 6 figures a year. That would NEVER have happened in the UK. I can’t imagine how life would’ve turned out under my father’s watch …. a skint spinster living in the village catering to HIM no doubt. I shudder at the thought LOL Poverty is a bitch and many people NEVER make it out for a variety of reasons. LUCK has everything to do with it, whether one is in the right place at the right time, intelligence quotient , unrelenting motivation, gender even…..etc etc.
Thanks for sharing this Sandy! I applaud women for pulling themselves out of the sick stranglehold of oppression and without becoming resentful!
I definitely had some lucky breaks… lots of kids in similar situation who didn’t get good grades. I recall a time where I was sure I was going to be arrested, but then the cop asked who my grandpa was and then let me go. I guess he knew him, cuz dropping grandpa’s name wasn’t exactly a get out of jail free card. And I lived in a small town, so I wasn’t an anonymous student and some teachers really cared.
Thank you for sharing your story and experience. I wish you a very bright and happy future, you’ve definitely earned it.
Sandy, I miss your blog! Is there any way to pm me a way to keep following you?
best thing i ever stole from Dave Ramsey is his tagline, “I’m doing better than I deserve.” Cultivating an attitude of gratitude is the healthiest thing I’ve ever done
As someone who has followed a very similar path, although with my own nuances, I really appreciated this post. Thank you!
In case you’re looking for more blog post topics, it would be particularly interesting and helpful if you could write about the following related topics:
– How have you dealt with the difference between yourself and your family/old friends (people who knew you before)? This could include decisions about how to talk about financial issues with them, whether (and how) you give loans or gifts because I’m sure that you’ve been asked, and more generally how you talk about (minimize/promote/other) your lifestyle when talking with them…
– How have your frugal tendencies changed? You included a point about realizing the silliness of saving $20 for a connection, but there are all kinds of examples on a continuum. I think of this as a journey, and it would be insightful to hear how you have changed and where you expect to continue to change going forward.
– How are you trying to raise Jr to have some of the good values that come from being raised in poverty?
Thanks again for the insightful post!
Wow. Great post. Your best so far!
Now imagine how bad kids in less fortunate countries must feel? My wife grew up in socialist Eastern Europe. It brings a tear to my eye every time she tells me the f’ed up shit she had to go through as a child. No food, no clothes, crazy brain wash propaganda, fear of the government, abusive father…
It was the fear of having to go back to this life that made her work her ass off and become the successful woman she is now. I’m immensely proud of her!
Thank you for this post. I didn’t realize so many FIRE bloggers had difficult childhoods. I can identify with most of what you wrote. My parents passed away shortly after we immigrated to the US. I lost my father at 7 and my mother at 12, although she was stricken with cancer even before my dad passed, so much of those 5 years she wasn’t well. When the cancer spread it affected her cognitive functions so she didn’t even recognize us kids for the last year. I can’t imagine what those years must have been like for her. We survived on food stamps and charity for many years. As an immigrant with no English skills and who wore home-knit clothes to school, I was ostracized, bullied, and ridiculed for most of my grade school years. I think most kids had no idea what I was going through at home. I never attended father-son school events, or any other school events for that matter. When I got the measles, I spent a week at home by myself with 104+ fever, and still remember the hallucinations. I had no one to help me with homework, provide guidance or preach morals, or attend my graduations. Yet the only two times I remember crying were at my father’s funeral and the first time a classmate showed some compassion towards me. I sadly remember that the last months of my mother’s life were so difficult that I only felt relief when she passed.
The experiences shaped our futures. My oldest sister moved away for college and married at 21 for some security. Eventually she worked her way up to a managing director position at a large software consultancy with 200 people reporting to her. My other sister graduated from the top medical school and is a medical school professor, an author, and a practicing nephrologist. I started working at age 12, and never stopped until I early retired at 39. I worked multiple part-time jobs during school semesters, and full-time all summers, managed to avoid becoming a drug addict and graduated valedictorian from a nationally ranked high school. I paid for all my college expenses and even graduated with $5000 in the bank from all the jobs, but never had much of a social life in school since all my hours were filled. I was also never much able to identify with peers, they all had such a different life than me. Eventually I became a very early employee at what is now one of the biggest tech companies, and retired after 14 years of working there.
I still deal with the demons though. Not sure those ever go away. The feelings of loss, insecurity, helplessness, distrust, uncertainty, and what-ifs. But I realize those feelings and being able to reflect on them are a luxury, things could have turned out so differently. I also realize how lucky I have been and hope the luck holds out.
I’m glad you have come out the other end. :-)
I didn’t realize so many FIRE bloggers had difficult childhoods, either. Although I guess I’m not that surprised, there probably aren’t many 1% bloggers
Could be some fun reading though:
10 tips to increase your allowance from Daddy
How to talk to your parents about early inheritance
The struggle of traveling by private aircraft
Glad you came out the other end too, Ty. You’ve overcome so much.. I started to cry reading through your story, the moment you cried when a classmate showed some compassion brings back a few memories…
Cheers to overcoming demons. My hopes and best thoughts are with you
Jeremy
I should add, I am so grateful to being able to grow up in this country. I am almost certain it is the only country where I could have made it out from my situation. God Bless the USA!
Thank you for sharing your story, hits me right in the gut. I can relate to so much of what you went through, thanks so much for this.
That is a wonderful story … it is good to be thankful for things like family, accomplishments and even abundance… It helps keep us a little more level headed, pragmatic, loving and compassionate :) God Bless, CPO.
An interesting thought experiment within bounds of today’s social climate.
How would your life have been different growing up and what impact would it have had on future you if you had a universal income?
Would you still have been as driven?
Understand money as much?
…
Hard to say… potentially very different answers if UBI was $1,000 vs $10,000 vs $100,000.
I think UBI would have provided a sense of security that was lacking, which would have allowed me to take greater risks. I probably would have applied to Stanford and MIT. I would also have started a company or two.
You may have been dealt a bad hand, but you seem to have played it very well GCC! Congrats!
I can relate a little. Despite being worth millions, I’m still constantly in fear of financial failure.
Growing up, we never seemed to have enough to afford anything besides necessities — but the library was definitely a way to get free entertainment. Spending so much time reading has probably served me well.
Wow. Saying I relate would be a gross understatement. Your post touched me deeply. I feel my FIRE has been motivated and expedited by my own insecurities and fear of scarcity, no doubt a product of my having grown up in relative poverty.
I am 43 now, 3 years retired with way more than I need to be comfortable forever, but still a very long way from being “accustomed to wealth”. Thanks again for this, it helps a lot.
wow another good one.
I can relate… for sure. lots of us can relate…
Just wanted to say thanks so much for sharing this. It takes a lot to open up about these sorts of things, but I think you sharing your experience is likely to help a lot of people along their own paths. I also thought your “mini rant” in the comments above was well said. The sort of victim blaming you were responding to is all too common and I think it largely just comes from a lack of exposure and empathy towards the people that are in these situations. We can all be better and do better to help our fellow citizens.
I think you are right about the exposure and empathy.
People tend to imagine their own success is due to their own greatness, and that others should be able to do what they do. “I worked hard and look how successful I am. Those poor people just don’t work hard enough – it’s a choice.”
There are 2 interesting questions we can ask:
– there are other people who are 10, 100, 1000x more successful than you. Why is that? Is it because you didn’t work hard enough?
– if you started over again today, could you do exactly the same things you did before and still succeed? No changes allowed.
The answers are probably:
– some people were more successful than me because of luck / connections / timing / slightly different skills, and some were less, even though we all worked as “hard”
– probably not. Microsoft already had it’s run, Bill Gates couldn’t just start Microsoft in 2018 and become a multi-billionaire. Times change, the business and cultural environments change.
Without trying and being a perpetual victim one will never succeed. So yes, to some extent your success is your result. There are other factors, attitude, drive, persistence. Luck favors the prepared. Take advantage of and make your opportunities to grow.
For me, the 10x answer is because I’m happy with what I have. I worked hard for the sucesss. My family supported me and I supported them. Tons of work and dedication to the career and growing wealth.
One of my favorite quotes: “Luck is not chance, it’s toil. Fortune’s expensive smile is earned.” Emily Dickinson
Great article, thanks for getting personal about your history with the biographical candid sketch. I certainly see you are Blessed and have abundance in your life. Your child is adorable. Our Children and the joy they bring us is what life’s all about!
On my path to FI…I still struggle with money insecurity. I enjoyed this article because I feel like it’s taboo to say that…we should all just be stoic and positive. Well I appreciate where you were coming from and your roots. It’s good to at least knowledge that these early childhood memories and impressions of money, security, and stability leave a dent on some of us. Maybe it would be good if there were more articles on this–on how to be frugal, save, and improve your situation but also get over the scarcity complex(because we all know, deep down money won’t ultimately fix that).
Hi Luke, I’m with you on the taboo stuff. I think even just a few years ago it would have been hard for me to share this much.
I do the stoicism stuff a little different, I think. To me we should feel all feelings to the fullest, even if they are “negative.” If we acknowledge them and not try to suppress it, then we can move forward. Over time the difficult emotions lose power over us.
You mentioning your friend in 5th grade and how it was a turning point in your life is a reminder of how the little things we do can make a difference in other people’s life. It doesn’t matter how old we are, be kind and help others, it may make a big difference in their life.
What an incredible post, and how inspiring. Thank you – humility and uprightness. What’s FI without these, right?
GCC, This post almost brought me to tears as I could relate to some childhood sacrifices, which seemed so normal at that time, but now feels like another lifetime ago! It’s amazing how fortunate we are to have traversed so far up in one generation that even several generations of our ancestors couldn’t dream of doing. Thanks for staying grounded despite the wealth.
Slow clap.
I had humble beginnings also. Through a combination of luck, perseverance, and divine intervention, I was able to rise above it all.
I made mistakes along the way (i.e. lifestyle inflation). That’s why I am trying to learn from wise people like you and your wife.
Thanks for the inspiration.
Thank you sir.
Mistakes are great learning tools. I’ve made quite a few.
Good. This is something I really won’t like to become: Accostumed to wealth.
I want to live below my means forever for a greener and healthier planet !
This was great! Totally relatable. Military family. Nice hair! I had great hair once upon a time! I thought school=smart=money=happiness when I was younger. Funny how now I just want time. Will time=happiness? Will location independence? FI? I just need to work on being happy now. Thanks for the post.
Your writing has really improved since I’ve been reading from 2015 – what an absolutely fascinating read this was.
Your courage to embrace your deepest darkest fears and conquer them is really commendable. That takes courage!
I can relate to some of this and I am pushing to retire early as well.
My target is 50 – 8 more years until I follow in your footsteps. :-)
Thanks man. Hopefully others feel the same :)
It’s cliche but 8 years really does go by fast. My bro is on a similar timeline
Saw you tagged in article on Fatfire … you may enjoy it … https://www.physicianonfire.com/fatfire/
As a former-UK now nomad guy, just a small point – what do you mean by the comment “before Brexit, obviously”? Brexit was voted for, but nothing has actually happened of substance yet (aside from devaluation of the £ – grr). Certainly nothing to restrict the rights of US citizens to travel there – Apologies if I’ve missed the point somewhere.
Anyway, very enjoyable post, thanks.
It’s piece of this quality that keep me coming back! Keep it up!
I remember being made fun of at a school state competition for my flare cords bought from a thrift store. We couldn’t afford otherwise. Congrats to excelling out of your impoverished youth. I know that wasn’t easy as many generations tend to follow in the same poverty footsteps (like me, trying to get out of debt but stuck on replay).
Sooooo, you’re going to tell us you almost died after graduation and not expand on that? Also, sorry to hear about your friend.
It was an adventure :)
See here:
https://www.gocurrycracker.com/clawing-out-of-debt/
Thank you for your condolences :(
My extended family is poor- different, I guess, in that they never tried to work. I still don’t understand why they kept having kids after they lost their house. It seemed cruel, and the kids really suffered. Now the kids are the third generation in the same circumstances despite a whole lot of advantages (American birth, privileged racial group, HeadStart, SNAP, free healthcare, good schools). I guess it really did affect their brains. But they received so much help that I don’t know what else could have been done.
You shouldn’t feel guilty about your brother, although of course you will. You did great with no older brother of your own. Congrats on making it.
Words of wisdom… thank you.
Great post. Thanks for sharing. Your brother and mother’s responses made me cry. You are giving good advice, keep at it.
I have stumbled upon your blog a few times since I found the FIRE movement and have never been disappointed. This one is no exception. Having grown up in poverty this one hit home. We are still building a life baby me would not even believe! I am, of course, proud of myself but I am also surprised by the feelings of fraud and guilt I have as we get closer and closer to reaching our ultimate goals. I am also surprised that when I am doing spreadsheets my “enough” seems ok but the closer we get to our “enough” the scarier it is. Will the other shoe drop? That is something I am going to have to work through in time.
Also, my family is mostly still struggling and it is so frustratingly difficult to understand that there is not anything I can really do to help them until they want to help themselves. They just don’t believe it is possible. I can’t blame them, I didn’t either at first! I love your blog even though I am way late to the game!